Garrosh: Future Raid Boss


[March 2012 Update: And we now have confirmation from various sources that Garrosh will be the final raid boss in MoP.]

In storytelling, there is an element known as the midpoint.  Simply put, it’s the middle of your story.

And what does it do?  Generally speaking, the exact opposite of your climax.  In other words, if your story ends with the hero beating the bad guy, then at the midpoint your hero is going to somehow lose.

So… why is this relevant?

Go back to right before WotLK was released, during the “Zombie Invasion”.

One of the key points during that world event was when we actually got to see Thrall and Garrosh step into the arena and fight it out.  Virtually all of us were shocked when Garrosh won the duel.

That fight was a midpoint.  It was placed there for all of the exact reasons why one inserts a midpoint into a story’s structure.  It casts doubt as to the fight’s actual outcome.  Before that duel, most figured Thrall could swat Garrosh like an insect.  Now, it’s a question.  Could Garrosh really beat Thrall?  Or did he only have the upper hand at that point in the fight when they were interrupted?  Further, this will add depth when the real event actually occurs.

And yes, there will be a “real event”.

What that fight confirmed for us was one thing:

At some point in the near future, Thrall is going to beat the living hell out of Garrosh.

Initially, the question was, “Would this happen in WotLK?”  But there really didn’t seem to be a clear opportunity for it.

Now with Cataclysm on the horizon, it all makes sense.

Thrall is gone, Garrosh left in charge.  We’ve already seen plenty of what Garrosh is going to do with Kalimdor in Thrall’s absence, evicting most races from Orgrimmar-Proper, etc..  Couple that with Garrosh killing Cairne (whether intentional or not) and you can see what is going to happen.

Thrall’s current greatest weakness is when he looks at Garrosh, he sees Grom.  A fanboy could even question whether or not this meant Thrall was pulling his punches during their original duel.  With the events of Cataclysm, Thrall will finally see clearly, and Garrosh will be in trouble.

Yes it’s predictable, but frankly, who cares?  An uninterrupted rematch is what we want.

So, will Thrall kill Garrosh?

Very doubtful.  In fact… No.  Thrall could not kill “Grom’s son”.

So what of Garrosh?  Probably exile.

Why?  Story reasons abound, but lets turn to game mechanics for a moment.

The answer is simple:

So we can kill him later.

If we want to follow a “sins of the father” theme, then Garrosh is destined to become a fel-orc.  Whether he does or not, though, it is still likely that at some point in WoW’s future he will become a raid boss.

Would Thrall help us then?  Doubt it, Garrosh is still Grom’s son.  But don’t forget, there is one other orc who has already outright threatened to kill Garrosh, Saurfang.

A raid in which we get to help Saurfang kill Garrosh?  Most of the horde fans would absolutely love it, and that alone is the best reason why Blizzard will probably eventually do it.

There is a current underlying concern being voiced throughout WoW that we’ll eventually run out of meaningful bosses… that the longer the game lasts, the better the chance we’ll run out of real bosses to fight.

This isn’t true.  In fact, the opposite is the case.

The longer WoW lasts, the more time its creative department has to develop lore.  This lore then turns into back-story as time passes, giving us meaningful depth for villains we’ll face in the future.

In other words, once WoW’s lore gains full momentum, meaningful boss encounters will become self perpetuating due to the “lore becoming back-story” process.  The only real concern we could have had was whether or not Warcraft’s lore possessed a plentiful enough roster of bosses to hold out until WoW achieved full momentum on its own.

This means tomorrow’s raid bosses are very likely in the game today.

Garrosh is a given, and dare I say Varian Wrynn probably is too.

Ner’zhul will also likely turn out to have survived and be looking for a host…


{ 27 comments… read them below or add one }

1 Ktok October - 2009 at 8:48 am

It’s strange that everyone assumes Garrosh will be bad for the Horde. There’s still plenty of time for him to come around, or for Wrynn to go so far off the deep end that it becomes clear we *need* Garrosh’s dubious morals to effectively protect us from the Alliance.

Sometimes, you need a monster to fight a monster. Wrynn, having openly declared his desire to wipe out the horde to the last infant on multiple occasions, is such a monster. Personally, I don’t think Thrall can stomach the war Wrynn wants to bring upon us. It’s not a war he’s willing or even able to fight. Garrosh, on the other hand, can fight that war. And he can win it.

To use a real world example, we won WW2 largely because we were willing to firebomb and nuke cities. We were willing to become monsters to defeat monsters. Now, we’re losing (or at best stalemated) in the so called war on terror because we are *not* willing to become monsters. We’re bogged down in morals and rules of conduct, and right or wrong, we can’t fight a war with a monster by throwing ethics at it. Flattening a few cities would go a long way to ending it, but we’re no longer capable of doing that. It wouldn’t be “right”.

Garrosh is old school war. Thrall is new school, hampered by compassion for the enemy even when no compassion for him is shown in return. Garrosh is going to prove to be a hero and a savior in the face of Wrynn’s crusade for Horde genocide. Just wait and see.

2 Honorshammer October - 2009 at 10:07 am

I don’t think Garrosh is Garrosh anymore. He’s so different from the sniveling little brat that gave you those quests.

He’s either a black dragon, or Dreadlord in disguise, or he’s been corrupted by an Old God. But he’s not the same Orc anymore.

3 Aldheim October - 2009 at 6:18 am

“Wrynn’s crusade for Horde genocide?”

…mmhmm. Remind me who attacked who at the Broken Front, again?

4 Tridus October - 2009 at 7:14 am

And who ignored the Forsaken while they developed a plague meant for genocide, during peace time?

And who enslaved Wrynn and threw him into a gladiator pit?

And who came through the Dark Portal bent on eradicating humanity?

You don’t think Wrynn was provoked or anything, do you?

5 Solid October - 2009 at 8:01 am

Oh yeah, it’s not Wrynn’s fault he wants to eradicate the Horde, blame the horde itself, good idea. Thats like blaming the Holocaust on the Jews.

6 Taiki October - 2009 at 8:23 am

Yes, so stating obvious facts, along with the horde’s mercilessness in icecrown (attacking a fleet of alliance while they were fighting scourge facing the other direction) got pushed aside just because we’re ‘blaming’ them.


I really like this game, and both factions. But it’s easier for me to play Ally and ‘observe’ the Horde, especially with the direction they are taking.

7 Aldheim October - 2009 at 8:39 am

Sweet, a Godwin by post#5!

8 Germ October - 2009 at 8:54 am

It doesn’t matter if Cairne gets killed by Garrosh, he can just pop resurrection.

But if we do kill Garrosh with Saurfang we need to do a fist-bump after.

And I like Honorshammer’s theory.

9 hollow October - 2009 at 1:04 pm

It’s more like blaming the Allies/French for punishing the Germans so badly in the Treaty of Versailles at the end of WWI that they primed the stage for a rapid growth in ugly extremist factions in Germany until it boiled over into a new war.

Except it is only more like that than the utterly unrelated crap #5 tried to claim. It’s not really like Europe from 1914-1945 at all, and should be assessed on its own merits.

10 el Greco October - 2009 at 3:57 pm

Very interesting article… Once again, I love reading these, hence the reason why I check Loregy so often : ) But lol! All you commentators should stop taking things so personal and see the beauty of these stories from an outside perspective.

By taking sides in this (either the Horde’s or the Alliance’s) you all become way too focused on one another’s mistakes and too blind towards your own defects! My god! Look at you all starting to lay down your own philosophies and linking them to world war 2 and other crazy things of that sort!!

Solid even went as far as saying, “Oh yeah, it’s not Wrynn’s fault he wants to eradicate the Horde, blame the horde itself, good idea. Thats like blaming the Holocaust on the Jews.” You’re trying to victimize the powerful Horde by associating them with the unfortunate Jews during the Holocaust??? Now that’s just low! x’D

11 snuzzled November - 2009 at 2:23 pm

The fact is, every time the Horde attacked the Alliance, it was not of their own volition. You cannot blame the Horde for what they did under the influence of the Demon blood, when they first came through the Dark Portal. They weren’t in control of their own actions. They were corrupted monsters. I’m a diehard Horde fan, and I readily admit that.

However, once their corrupted Bloodlust was cured, they became completely new people. The same people they had once been on their native planet: peaceful, shamanistic, noble. Still frightening if met on a battlefield, but not willing to wage war for wars’ sake. Jaina has made peace with the Horde. Thrall also has forgiven the humans’ their past sins and looks to peace. Wrynn just cannot see past what the corrupted orcs did, and wants to kill them all. Yay Wrynn?

Who enslaved the orcs on a mass scale in internment camps? Oh right, the humans. So I don’t think that’s really fair to bring up what a renegade band of orcs did with one lousy human. Which, by the way, they’d never have gotten a chance to do this to him if he hadn’t been kidnapped in the first place. It’s not like they intentionally saw out to kidnap and enslave Varian Wrynn. I think if they initially knew who they had, they’d have treated him a lot differently.

And re: the Forsaken plague, you seriously cannot blame the Horde for that. The Forsaken concocted that plague on their own, intended to kill both Horde and Alliance. Attacking the entire Horde because the Forsaken tried to kill them? Yeah, that’s a great logic, there…

12 ***** November - 2009 at 4:19 pm

You seriously think that a man who watched his city and his father murdered by the Horde has no right to a grudge? The same man being thrust into delirious slavery for years cannot blame the Horde for they caused yet again? Then he comes back to find his new allies beset by advancing forces of the very thing he despises and he is supposed to be passive about it all?
The Horde, for the most part, have always been centered around destruction. How can one deduce such? Ashenvale is a wonderful example. Your logic is flawed to assume that the orcs were just the peaceful hunter-gatherers they were on Draenor. The blood CORRUPTED them, Thrall is an anomly not to have a sense of war and aggresive expansion.
And shall we move on to the Orcs’ allies, the technical majority of the “new Horde?” The trolls are clinically brutal and violent, only indentured to the Orcs after they got their big blue butts saved from the Naga. The Forsaken are crusading against the LIVING and reluctantly allied so as not to be crushed. The HORDE is partly composed of A LEGION OF UNDEAD WHOSE ULTIMATE PREROGATIVE IS TO KILL THE EFFING WORLD. But that’s no reason to try and phase ’em out, says you.

That’s my fanboy soap box, over all the Horde-nuts are pissy that we actually have a legitimate leader to stand behind. The Alliance is technically stronger for having survived under the foremost rule of a child over the course of what…four/five years?

13 Give November - 2009 at 4:49 am

Why I Roll Horde and Why All Ally Must Die!
(or step aside.)

Thrall and his Orc brethren suffered a life of slavery upon their defeat. The same war which freed them of their demonic blood made them slaves to the exploitive barons of the Alliance. It’s been many generations since the demon possessed horde came bellowing out of the dark portal hungry for blood after being summoned by a powerful human warlock.

The new horde was born from hardships suffered under Alliance’s greed, misguided ethics and bad memories. The horde is just awakening as a people. Honor, compassion and patience are two new incantations that have been added to the Horde’s powerful mantra of blood and thunder. Thrall is a just leader, who defends his new kingdom from threats within and from the ruthless and ignorant alliance leadership. He has even allowed the Blood Elves to join his ranks, while the human Alliance betrayed them during their weakest hour. Sure Horde is green, ugly, warty and weird on the outside, at least they are not monsters on the inside.

While the Alliance follows the same blindly ambitious footsteps that led Arthas astray the Horde is led by a true noble savage. Jania Proudmore being the only hope for peace between both factions. Thrall is not even a key player anymore because, he has already led the Horde. His courage has lead the Horde into a new paradigm, the whole culture of the Horde has changed. Just go to Nagrand and witness the future of the Horde. They are no longer mindless bonechewers who serve demons, but are starting to resemble the Matriarchal culture of the great mother found in Nagrand. In a way, even though Thrall is loved he is no longer needed, the Horde like the gentle Tauren can live in harmony, if those alliance idiots would just stop attacking.

Even Nazgrel can lead the Horde in the path Thrall has laid out. With that said, Garrosh must never have power. He is a danger which only someone with the patience and compassion of the Dali Lama can tolerate. (Thrall)

On the other end of the spectrum. Alliance is not seeking to better themselves as a people. They keep going darker and darker. Their greed and xenophobia is only shadowed by the ignorance of their leaders. They lack honor, they are a disgrace to themselves fumbling at every footstep. Even seeking Horde champions for aid in Ice Crown because they cannot defeat the Lich King (A monster of their own creation by themselves.)

Kid’s roll alliance because they see them as heroes, but that is just a superficiality. While the Horde still struggles for freedom against the alliance, it is willing to work with them to end the Lich King’s reign. The Alliance is working to eradicate the Horde, if it weren’t for the Lich King, Alliance would still be on their crusade to end the Horde.

Any mindless Alliance who crosses my path should die for following their leaders like lemmings. I have no qualms p00ning nubs.

14 Give November - 2009 at 4:52 am

sorry needs editing^ 😛

15 ***** November - 2009 at 4:39 pm

You present nothing to back up your claims of the Alliance being dishonorable, and those that do have some meat behind them carry falsehoods:

1. Nice sneaking in that “human” for Medivh. You fail to mention the bloodlust-inflicted Horde willingly went under the sway of the Burning Legion, whose leader possessed said warlock.

2. “He cannot see past the corrupted orcs.” Wrong, he can’t really get over the trauma he suffered plus the modern brutality he witnessed whilst enslaved. That crude look he carries is straight from the days he was deemed Lo’Gosh in the Crimson Ring.

3. The “human” alliance also includes the Night Elves who scorn their Bloody brothers for their continued addiction to the arcane. That tension can’t exist within an Alliance, however the Horde was able to open its doors only because of the lack of association they previous had with the BE.

4. “Alliance follows the same blindly ambitious footsteps that led Arthas.” Explain, when did the Allies pick up a dark weapon and start obeying the voices coming it from it? Did the faction’s best friend get killed by Mal’Ganis?

5. Got to Nagrand? One goes to Nagrand and they find Garrosh. Garrosh! Nagrand is the worst thing that happened to the Horde.

6. “Xenophobia,” “darker and darker….” Uh which faction is racially cleansing their central capital? How much assassination and usurping is occurring amongst the Allies in Cataclysm? How many duels did Wyrnn have with Fordragon right before Wrath? Is there really any tension any of the races? Which faction bombs villages with a flesh-eating plague? Are the dwarves known for their headshrinking?

7. The Argent factions are lead by a human, but they have no association with the Alliance. Although that does help my point, which of the Horde’s powerful warriors are forming groups that are the only real driving force against the Lich King?

8. On a final note: the Lich King is the Horde’s fault. He is, after all, a former warchief. As scripts from ICC suggest the only thing keeping him from ripping apart the world is the ALLIANCE’S fallen warrior with whom he shares a body.

Cute essay, but no dice.

16 ***** November - 2009 at 4:42 pm

Also, apologies for the typoes.

17 Nini January - 2010 at 4:45 pm



Listen, if both races didn’t have their justifications and flaws, why the hell would anyone want to play one or the other?

There are cruelties BOTH have inflicted upon the others. There are unfortunate events that BOTH of them have endured.

If you really want to compare this to a real life conflict, don’t. That’s dumb, and cheapens the real life conflicts.

Both factions have reason to believe they are justified in what they do. Both factions push things a little far sometimes because they are passionate about what they believe. Despite the circumstances, both of them have suffered terrible losses and both of them hold legitimate grudges. Grudges that can’t be set aside easily.

So as touching as it is that everyone is so loyal to their own faction, seriously…take a step back and look at it from, say, the Naaru’s perspective. If one race or the other were truly through and through evil, do you think they’d be allowed into Shatt?

18 SneakyDevil February - 2010 at 11:01 am

My theorys. It may be that garrosh may find that thralls lack to take controlle is revolting, so maybe he’ll try to take matters into his own hands much like Arthas did with the culling of strat. i Think garrosh,with many followers, will break off and be not exactly demons but blood thirsty orcs, which i think will cause some sort of event in cata. or on the other hand garrosh may seek another pool of demon blood. Another theory i have is in cata a great way between the alliance and horde will break out, since they are kinda working together in WOTLK to take down the lichking. but it is way to soon to think of anything that may happen. Expect the unexpected with blizzard

19 SneakyDevil February - 2010 at 11:03 am

and add that maybe garroshes will to “save” his people will have the same ending as arthas’s will to “save” his people. i think this will lead to his eventuall insanity

20 latusthegoat March - 2012 at 9:39 am

3 cheers for mostly accurate raid boss prediction!

21 Cocles March - 2012 at 1:54 pm
22 araman April - 2012 at 8:09 pm

When saurfangs son died and Muradin couldn’t let him past Wryn was the one who showed up out of no where and told saurfang to give his son a hero’s burial and letting him past (and giving muradin a smacked bottom) meaning that he isn’t a heartless bastard who’s knee bent on destroying the horde. Read the comics most and you’ll find out that he’s tricked into not liking thrall because orcs and horde races attack the alliance soldiers and alliance races attack the horde soldiers, of course its the twilight hammer attacking each faction with the opposite faction races at a peace summit. (someone correct me if i’m wrong) and he kinda saw his dad murdered in front of him by what he saw as an orc, (garona halforcen)

23 Buffb April - 2012 at 10:48 am

okay guys lets move past the wonderful in depth lore that blizzard masterfully crafted and get to the simple point that the alliance consists of gnomes dwarves and other various creatures who dont eat their veggies

24 Hak September - 2012 at 5:56 pm

Wait there is a story in wow? LOL I thought you just picked up tons of quests and do them as fast as you can to get to max level to do the same raid over and over until they release a new raid to do over and over. Ohhh wait I had to read a comic book to know the story in WOW lol. Blizz sucks and rapes their customers for every cent they can, but there is no story to be had in this game and if it is intended to have one they clearly made it to easy to avoid it. I have many friends who still play WOW and not one of them can tell me what the plot of the game is.

25 Cocles September - 2012 at 6:17 pm

I read that more as a criticism of your friends than anything else. Fortunately for Blizzard, most lore-junkies like to read. 😉

You could argue that the problem could be fixed by having the quest givers actually speak. Bioware tried this with SWTOR, but you’ll still find a noticeable amount of players there who just spam the spacebar to skip everything.

In Vanilla WoW, I remember running across a group who had zero idea what was going on plot-wise. I asked how they could enjoy the game without any context for what they were doing. They all agreed that they, “just liked clicking on things and watching stuff happen.” I’m glad they’re so easily entertained. The lore is for those of us who require a little more stimulation than just a Skinner box.

26 Brian May - 2013 at 6:40 pm

Hey there! I know this is somewhat off-topic
but I needed to ask. Does running a well-established website
such as yours take a massive amount work? I am completely new to blogging however I do write in my journal everyday.
I’d like to start a blog so I can easily share my experience and views online. Please let me know if you have any kind of recommendations or tips for brand new aspiring blog owners. Thankyou!

27 Cocles May - 2013 at 8:17 pm

@Brian I wouldn’t describe it as a *massive* amount of work, but it’s definitely *work*. What throws a lot of would be bloggers is the novelty aspect of it. When you first begin, it’s all fun and games, because it’s new! One that newness wears off though, once the novelty is gone, it really becomes a matter of dedication. Can you keep posting even when it’s not fun? I think I found a good balance with Loregy. My only problem right now is Grad School, which has kept me too occupied to post for awhile. Eventually though, I will return.

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